Bill
I'm having an issue understanding the billing for my usage this month.
My subtotal came up to 10.05$ and I have the hobby plan, so the included usage was removed but then it adds the hobby plan fee?
Also, postgres is quoting a lot more than it is on our end - why would that be? It used more than 1GB of RAM while having basically no records (or even 0). This is a screenshot from our docker postgres image with a lot of records only using 200MB.
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Project ID:
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Also, I don't quite understand the hobby plan saying I have 8GB of RAM but it quotes me without me having used them? Or am I seeing the information wrongly?
Also, no entries have been added to our environments. Feel free to check our logs to confirm that nothing was generated.
This is our Docker container, which is in use and always has new entries, unlike Railway, which rarely has new entries.
@fgouvea10 is apart of the team so he can handle the ticket aswell.
My subtotal came up to 10.05$ and I have the hobby plan, so the included usage was removed but then it adds the hobby plan fee?this is correct, the hobby plan costs 5$ a month and comes with 5$ in resource usage, so nothing out of the ordinary here.
postgres is quoting a lot more than it is on our end - why would that be? It used more than 1GB of RAM while having basically no records (or even 0).this could be many factors, different environments, different postgres configurations, also nothing out of the ordinary.
I don't quite understand the hobby plan saying I have 8GB of RAM but it quotes me without me having used them? Or am I seeing the information wrongly?that's correct, you can use up to 8gb of ram per service/plugin, since that is what the hobby plan allows for, railway will only bill for what you use
Hmmm, I see - so your support is telling me that there is nothing out of the ordinary.
Is it possible, or asking too much to get it investigated? @brody192
Having issues understanding this - what would be included usage?
So basically I used more than 8GB and that's what I'm paying for? The extra, right?
I'm not seeing anything that needs to be investigated at this moment
everything is normal as far as I can see
included usage - railway gives the hobby plan 5$ in credits to spend on usage, aka included usage
using more than 8gb - per service this is not possible, you are only charged what you used, collectively you could use more than 8gb but per service the max is 8gb as dictated by the plan you are on (hobby)
you have a bill of 10$ I'm sorry but I'm just not seeing anything out of the ordinary here, everything looks as it should
So you guys believe it is normal that my local postgres that receives constant new entries uses 25MB and at railway I'm using 1,40+GB with no new entries?
I used 10$, shouldn't my bill be 5$ in that case? Sorry I'm not quite understanding
Gotcha
we're seeing a charge for RAM we haven't used, that's a discrepancy that should be further investigated.
I believe it is at the very least unprofessional that you take absolutely no effort in explaining me why it is happening.
I think it would be better if someone provides a detailed breakdown of the resource utilization metrics that led to the charges on our latest bill. Specifically, we would like to understand why the postgres service is consuming over 1GB of RAM when my local Docker instance with similar load only uses around 25MB. Are there particular configurations or background processes on the hosted service that could explain this difference?
I'd also like to note that the ennironment variables are identical for both instances.
I'd like to note that I do not work for railway, either way the attitude vidanova has displayed is not appreciated
Oh I'm sorry if you feel that way, it is not my intention at all to come out aggressive - I'm just a bit frustrated and trying to understand what is going on mainly with the billing.
But if you do not work for Railway, I believe that we cannot be helped by you, is it possible for us to get someone qualified for the support?
as you are on the hobby plan you only have access to community support, I am part of the community, if you would like direct support from a team member you may want to look into upgrading to the pro plan
but let's reiterate on the 200mb Vs 1gb postgres service
Ok, but it seems like my issue might need more in-depth investigation. is there any escalation path for issues like this within the Hobby plan or am I limited to community assistance?
25mb vs 1+GB*
Can we never get assistant from higher ups because we didn't pay for so?
respectfully, at this time i dont believe this needs to be escalated, i will need some further information
so you're saying that even if my API does absolutely nothing, Railway could charge me in 1 milion dollars and nobody will investigate it because I'm on the hobby plan?
Would like clarification on this as well when possible 🙂
the team can be brought in when there is a platform issue
Then respectfully, what makes you believe there is not need for this to be escalated?
That's what I've been asking since the beginning.
i have seen postgres use 1gb on railway before, i have even seen it use several gigabytes more, using 1gb doesnt seem like cause for concern yet
keyword, yet
Oh so your method of evaluation is comparison? Excuse me but I believe that is not the best metric for our current situation.
let me get some more information from you
For sure, let's go 🙂
this postgres service you have deployed that is using 1+gb, is this a solid 1+gb all the time?
No, which is even stranger.
Let me show you
Remember, very very rarely an entry goes in on this service.
Minimum is 1,45GB and maximum is 1,75GB.
if you have already mentioned this, sorry, but is there any data in that database?
@fgouvea10 is my CTO he'll be able to answer any question related to that
yes.
is there the same or a comparable amount of data in your local database?
In the Railway database there is some data, but nothing significant. Our local database has much more
how did you deploy this database to railway? did you use the postgres plugin or did you use the new database template?
I simply created the database exactly as I did in the repositories. just a right-click and 'New Database,' that's all
okay you used the default postgres plugin
I guess
what version and image are you using locally?
3
15, sorry.
I'm using image
bitnami/postgresql:15okay lol i was gonna say postgres doesnt have a version 3
yeah lmao
railway uses postgres 13, specifically this image
timescale/timescaledb-postgis:latest-pg13
could there be some differences with what postgres 13 holds in memory vs postgres 15?From 25MB to 1,45+GB?
its possible
If so, please change the version of your postgres
Or am I just being dumb?
again, i dont work for railway lol
Then we shall get someone that does?
no, it's not. the difference in memory usage between 1GB and 25MB is quite substantial and unlikley to be solely due to versions differences
would you like to try to restart your railway database, this can be done from within the plugins settings
I've already deleted the project because I was about to be quoted more than 15$
then there actually wouldnt be anything for the team to investigate anymore
Because my project was deleted?
No archives or logs remain from deleted projects?
nothing of use, if you delete your project it is gone as the popup dialog says
I think what vidanova wants to ask is, does the staff not keep logs from projects?
There is no monitor done or saved from staff on projects?
If your local database doesn't run that much of queries, Postgres is not caching some of the data in your RAM.
I've seen this behavior in one of my databases in Railway which have some data, when I do a query (even a small) it'll consume RAM, restarting it drops the cache and goes to 20-100mb.
they keep telemetry most likely, they dont keep metrics
I have the metrics myself
I sent them above
thats a screenshot
What do you want, for me to re-code it and send a link?
We have restarted the postgres some times and it still shows it didn't even lower to less than 1,45GB
Never
This is absurd. Restarting the database to be charged less money? I think this is something Railway should handle, not us
if you deploy a fresh new database it will use the idle memory, it wouldnt be a reproducible example
Should I be reproducing the issues of this platform?
I'm very sorry I'm really not understanding
friendly reminder that this kind of attitude is not appreciated
Also - could you help me over here?
Didn't you deleted the project? I'm confused
Yes when I saw the bill
This is not an issue, it's a Postgres normal thing
so we need to open an issue for postgres on github for productions errors 😉
you used 10$ of resources
railway gives you 5$ to use towards resource costs
a hobby plan costs 5$
10$ - 5$ + 5$ = 10$
If you think that speeding up your queries performance in the cost of RAM is an issue, then...
Then I'm confused as per what the hobby plan gives me quite frankly
we're using prisma, which offer ways to optmize queries
So I'm paying 5$ to have limited resources?
Includes 5$ of usage monthly, yes. So I paid 5$ for that. Shouldn't it be 10$ - 5$?
What is the sense of doing 5$ - 5$?
You're taking what you're offering me?
lmao
im sorry but you are misunderstanding how ths billing works
Haven't I said that a couple of times?
😄
I'm really not understanding
i have also explained it a couple of times
sure
Are you using any prisma hosted service? (Accelerate or data proxy) if no, then prisma doesn't cache that much or not at all.
hey thalles wanna throw your hat in the ring on this billing breakdown?
yes actually, i know it sounds funny but that is correct
you use 10$ of resources
you get 5$ off
your total is now 5$
you also get charged 5$ for the hobby plan
thats back to 10$
Yes, Hobby plan has a fee of 5$ per month which will be converted into a 5$ discount.
You still pay the 5$ but you get 5$ discount for your resource usage (CPU, RAM)
Think of it like a subscription with discount of 5$ in usage
it sounds a little silly when you say it like that, you pay 5$ for the hobby plan, its a subscription fee
What you mean you got nothing?
if the hobby plan didnt come with the 5$ of included usage your total would then actually be 15$ so yes you are getting a discount still
im sorry but you are still not understanding
i do, but you are not doing the math correctly
this is the math broken down
One question, what is the amount on your invoice?
Ok, let me look it up. I think our billing breakdown is off by $5 here
Yeah it looks like the included usage isn't actually deducted from the subtotal
This is what your upcoming invoice looks like, and what you'll be charged ($5.04)
theres no 5$ hobby plan fee there?
It's a subscription cycle thingy.
The plan fee for $5 paid at start of current billing cycle carries until the end of current billing cycle, and since the sub is cancelled there's no $5 at the start of next billing cycle.
Thus, the hobby plan isn't in there after this cycle and there's no plan fee (but you still get $5 off included usage as that's what you've paid for at the start of current cycle)
So:
- t=0 start of billing cycle -> $5
- t=1 cancel sub
- t=2 next billing cycle doesn't start, no $5
We gotta fix that bill breakdown calculation on our end for sub cancellations
so they still would be paying for the fee, so the costs would still technically be 10$ all in all?
did you tell me that?
I see a few things off:
- You're comparing local metrics to platform metrics, which will always be inaccurate due to differences in image/runtime/optimizations etc.
- Your screenshot of 2GB RAM is for your project, which can contain other services. It's the sum total of usages in a project. Is it just the database using 2GB RAM?
Let's chill here, this is very clearly on us for miscommunicating the bill breakdown
to be fair, i have never given railway a single cent, so I am not familiar with the billing cycle
If they cancel the sub, they won't get charged another $5 for the subscription at the end of cycle/start of next cycle
It's confusing ðŸ«
these things where not communicated to me by them
also on us, sorry. I did not know about this until this thread
its alright it would have been good information for them to open the thread with
I can't view the breakdown because your project is deleted, but it's common for apps to incur memory even when they're not in use.
How many services were you running and what type of workloads/frameworks were they running on?
With all due respect, please stop escalating this
So this is my project running on Next, with also very few visits.
Next apps hover around 300~500mb memory, Node can typically take more depending on what you're running. We can narrow it down if you had screenshots from metrics tab of your individual services, but with the project deleted it's a bit of a debugging dead-end y'know what I mean?
There's also https://docs.railway.app/reference/usage-limits if you're concerned about costs stacking up when your project is inactive
Did you have other environments?
What about preview/PR environments?
I can't do much with a deleted project, all I can give you are guesses as to why it happened. Which are not great answers, because it's as much a shot in the dark as you're currently in 🙂
You’re welcome! Would also be curious to hear why you’re moving away from Railway. Any feedback to share?
Hey there VidaNova (@.goncalomedeiros) - I am sorry that you had a bad experience with Railway and we will work to rectify the situation. However, your behavior is not tolerated. Conductors are not Railway staff, they are moderators who are compensated with credits and work tirelessly to make sure that the community is well regarded. You violated both rules 2, and 3 of our #🛂｜readme. As such you must be removed from the server.
For any further questions, you can contact us at [email protected]. I have refunded your bill as to make sure that we are now even. I am sad to see you go, but even sadder that you chose to behave this way.
I'm sorry, everyone. We were just trying to understand what could have happened here. I've never seen something like this in my years of experience, and our questions were not being answered clearly.
Again, I'm sorry.
I think reporting a bug vs. and being disrespectful has a difference. Anyway, refund processed and you should see a difference in your bill in 5 - 10 business days.
Locking thread.