The Role of Tailoring in Achieving 'Effective' Fit

At one point this thread https://discord.com/channels/1116793467654381685/1228819227658424372 in questions and advice strayed a little off-topic and @toasterhacker9001 said (references to specific points from original thread omitted for length):
I'm a pretty objective/analytical guy, and I have a lean and muscular body that I'm comfortable in. [...] To me, clothes that "fit" have some room to move, but are still pretty close to the body. Not baggy, not sausage casing. I'm mostly interested in clothes that present a cohesive, professional image, since I'm mostly dressing for my slightly-below-business-casual tech job. I don't really do the "expression" type fashion, of wearing baggy clothes, tight clothes, statement pieces, etc. Nothing wrong with that and I can appreciate a good fit, it's just not my hobby

[...]

Muscular guys absolutely can wear baggy clothes without tailoring and look good in them. But I still stand by my opinion of, if you want a standard, neutral, businessy fit, it's really hard to achieve without alterations. Again, we're not talking hanging out with friends or hitting the club, we're talking going into the office. Also again, if anyone wants to prove me wrong, I will be forever grateful
I'm a pretty objective/analytical guy, and I have a lean and muscular body that I'm comfortable in. [...] To me, clothes that "fit" have some room to move, but are still pretty close to the body. Not baggy, not sausage casing. I'm mostly interested in clothes that present a cohesive, professional image, since I'm mostly dressing for my slightly-below-business-casual tech job. I don't really do the "expression" type fashion, of wearing baggy clothes, tight clothes, statement pieces, etc. Nothing wrong with that and I can appreciate a good fit, it's just not my hobby

[...]

Muscular guys absolutely can wear baggy clothes without tailoring and look good in them. But I still stand by my opinion of, if you want a standard, neutral, businessy fit, it's really hard to achieve without alterations. Again, we're not talking hanging out with friends or hitting the club, we're talking going into the office. Also again, if anyone wants to prove me wrong, I will be forever grateful
I think this is probably a better space to have this larger discussion aa there are rwo major questions - 1) how necessary is tailoring to achieve a fit or clothing acceptable for the workplace, especially if you're not the 'traditional' build (for purposes of this argument, average height and proportion) and 2) are there appropriate fits that don't require tailoring, or which are different from the "traditional" silhouette expressed above?
50 Replies
toasterhacker9001
Also brands Every piece fits differently, and I simply don't have the time and money to explore them all, although I have tried If there's anyone who knows of hidden gems, please share
Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
hold on, there was a good inspo thread on the sub about this (due to similar arguments), lemme see if i can dig it up Its doomed rip anyway depends on your workplace if you wear a blazer or sportcoat ya thats gonna need to be tailored same with a suit
toasterhacker9001
oh heck no i aint that fancy but agree
Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
if you wear a dress shirt or OCBD and like a sweater or something you really don't need tailoring
toasterhacker9001
What's OCBD
Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
Oxford Collar Cloth Button Down like th shirts gonna be tucked anyway and i think waist size really doesn't matter and i have a big drop
toasterhacker9001
... what is a drop
Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
difference between your chest size and waist size (normally in suits, eg a drop 8 might be a size 42 in jackets and size 34 in pants) my drop is like 10-12 depending on vanity
toasterhacker9001
Ah ok yeah Whenever I wear shirts tucked in I get tons of billowing and bagginess around the belly so I think I also have a big drop
Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
looks fine
pumaturtle
pumaturtle3mo ago
Hey man if you don’t know the term “drop” maybe you shouldn’t broadcast any sort of opinions on tailored clothing whatsoever
Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
eg: this is a vintage, completely untailored, brooks OCBD
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zeometer
zeometer3mo ago
high waisted, wider fit pant would help here
Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
only tailoring those pants got was a hem too
zeometer
zeometer3mo ago
makes the dorito shape of the upper body more pronounced and balances out the legs proportion
Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
ya a high waist pant with pleats will solve all these issues thats what im wearing there ive fucked with ivy i got examples of minimally tailored "dressyish" clothing
Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
same pants, only tailor done here was shortening the jacket sleeves and hemming the pants
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Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
(and tied my tie too long)
Guatemalean Toupee
Those pants are great ngl
Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
pants similarly got a hem
Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
this polo is knitted and can't be tailored, but i just flip the waistband cause im short and its fine:
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Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
rugby is untailored:
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Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
only thing here that is tailored is the pants were hemmed and the shirt sleeves were shortened, and you could easily switch the pants to something less extreme if you don't like that
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Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
only tailoring here was hemming the pants:
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Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
None of these are extremely fashion forward and yes some of the designs are loud, thats what i like, but im just showing the example you really don't need to tailor that much even if you are muscular
zeometer
zeometer3mo ago
and in terms of professionalism i work for a government contractor and the few times i've gone in-office i've never had an issue or received judgment for wearing wide pleated pants
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jawntanamo_bae
jawntanamo_bae3mo ago
Pleats are good, actually
Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
like ive said, now is legitimately the best time in fashion to be muscular and into fashion lol
zeometer
zeometer3mo ago
also! as someone with big quads and narrower shoulders a higher rise and pleats help balance things out visually
Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
im also pretty sure @metcarfre doesn't tailor his clothes that much and his waywt has lots of his work outfits that are pretty solidly bizcaz and he powerlifts at a pretty high level
zeometer
zeometer3mo ago
all this to say there's a larger spread of 'acceptable' fits that support a professional workplace and most of what i posted easily scales up to larger builds (imo more easily as the 'structure' is better defined, like with @smiles or @rej - "little man" )
Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
basically most of the tailoring will be sleeve length or hemming pants, which is normal for everyone (not just muscular people), and can be skipped sometimes jackets like what @zeometer wears will be more challenging that is true but you can also use less formal jackets for similar effects, see @artvandelayimporting for great examples of how almost any jacket will work over a shirt and tie
toasterhacker9001
This is all really helpful tysm
zeometer
zeometer3mo ago
and honestly if you're in a "smart casual" office, depending on your industry stuff like this might be fine outright
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Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
cardi is a great hack cardigans and sweaters are easy to wear over a shirt and look good and formal with minimal effort
toasterhacker9001
The biggest thing for me with pants is the waist, though. @smiles , you've got those green pants that look like they fit you really well. What's your approach to searching for pants that fit? I'm about 28 in the waist and waist sizes 31-33 fit on the thighs, so there must be more to it than just walking into a department store
Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
well, belt is always a good hack
toasterhacker9001
right one is fire and would absolutely be acceptable
zeometer
zeometer3mo ago
right one is a pair of levis 501s
bishopcorrigan
bishopcorrigan3mo ago
The green fatigues in question may have side adjusters which also help
Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
i forgot i did size those pants wrong slightly and had to bring the waist in, but thats cause i proxied them from japan and couldn't return them, i bought cargos from the same brand later a size down and they fit fine so its a skill issue. They do have size adjusters Its basically just look for straight/wide cuts. Levi's 550s, J. Crew Giant fit, the pants are just OG-107 fatigue replicas (Vietnam era US Army Fatigues), the wool pants are Todd Snyder "Officer Chinos"
Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
PRL Andrew pants fit well too, bought these vintage ones off ebay and didn't touch em:
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Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
like i don't buy pants without thigh measurements but the thing about muscular is wider pants will often look like less wide pants on you
zeometer
zeometer3mo ago
if you're willing to go secondhand, the pants for 2-5 were all secondhand polo ralph lauren andrews or hammonds pants which are common on ebay; i went one size up to exaggerate the pleats but true to (waist) size would look fine and achieve a similar result
Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
eg: these are 90s Levi's 550s, fits kinda bad but hey its old
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zeometer
zeometer3mo ago
re. jeans i shoved myself into levis 511s for the longest time before realizing other cuts looked better lol. this is the same shirt but with 501s vs 550s
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Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
these pants fit me fine with only a hem and they are from ALD who pretty much only does straight cut pants
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Smiles
Smiles3mo ago
honestly it just depends on how tight it is, i lucked out and that polo has a tight waistband it doesn't always work, supposedly theres a way to tie a shoelace around you and use that to blouse the shirt/sweater but i have found it too finicky some you might be able to tuck in and blouse over the pants a bit if its knit its a pain/impossible to tailor, if it isn't knit then yes a tailor could make it tighter (but you mind as well just hem it instead) to be fair a lot of my length issues are excerbated by lifting, as i wear size L-XL and I'm 5'8", so most are cut for taller men than me. But i generally can make it work if its sized Neck-Sleeve length thats easier
OceanicEternity
OceanicEternity3mo ago
I think that the default for healthily interacting with fashion is "I am beautiful these clothes are fun to wear." It's when your internal monologue is "I am not beautiful unless..." That it starts to become a problem. There's a sort of magical thinking. "If I just have ABC perfectly tailored items of clothes I will be beautiful." That I fall into. I... I really want to be beautiful. I really want to be admired. To an extent I think that there is a bit of the placebo effect in fashion. When you wear clothes that the old ladies at the bus stop say look good, you feel good and carry yourself differently. When you believe you look good you carry yourself differently. Fashion is a form of self expression. And often that is important, because it is a hallmark of the kind of people we are: a stamp of what we are likely to be which people respond to. But hallmarks only work because they are a mark of people: it is people who are looked at, and make impressions over time. Now I'm not going to say this is a bad thing. Some of my favourite shirts are shirts I wear because someone thought I would look good in them myself. It helped build my confidence. This is a forum for fashion enthusiasts. And as such people are very into finding their own style. But... Fashion is also about fitting in, being liked, being responded to well. So I think there is value in tailoring, simply because of the confidence it can give you.
AndrewA
AndrewA3mo ago
oxford cloth button down
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