Too Many UObjects but from where?
Similar issue to https://discord.com/channels/555424930502541343/1347860649610448950
currently experiencing consistent crashes. Generated Debug Info. Read some of it but not all 24k lines. Read a line within attributing the issue to UObjects. Followed aforementioned instructions. Removed "Additional_300_Inventory_Slots". My log is still telling me we're hitting the UObject limit. Following instructions at https://docs.ficsit.app/satisfactory-modding/latest/faq.html#_how_can_i_troubleshoot_crash_issues
SMM won't copy-paste my mods list. Will attempt restarting my computer.
What are my next steps?
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25 Replies
Is this something that happens repeatedly to you, or has this been a one-off? (UObject crashes can, rarely, crop up in edge-cases without them being reproduceable).
Also, be careful with Unlimited Autosaves in big factories. Saves get big, and you can end up filling up a lot of disk-space if you don't keep an eye on it.
Recently started repeatedly.
Ooh ya. I think my backup folder is 12 GBs rn? My eyes are very on. I constantly move stuff out of the main saves folder. But I prefer it, due to playstyle and health reasons.
Also, I saw a video once of someone who automated the rendering of buildables on a map of the game and it was so cool to see the "fungus in a forest" grow.
So, taking a page from Big Data, I'll just collect it until I can figure out how to use it how I want. Especially if the storage space is there. Which, it is. I tend to do things like this so I'm equipped for it. Couple TBs here and there.
I did wanna slim down any mods that majorly affect my performance. The way I'm using Andre's Portable Miner Collector is probably definitely......really really bad.
I just wonder if there are others.
Undo Construction & Cartograph strike me as possible sources of UObject overflow too. Enhanced Sorting falls into the "possibly, but unlikely" category. Also, probably unrelated, but something is fighting with CrashSiteBeacons (probably Cartograph).
Specifically when using a drop-down menu in the Digital Storage mod but, to my knowledge, other people haven't reported this AND, as I think, other mods are increasing that UObject count, making the one more normal one be an issue.
I haven't tried to see if I can force a crash in another way, although, I vaguely remember trying to fly (modded hoverpack so too fast for map loading) to paradise Island from the sam crater on the west edge of the red/pink place and it freezing and crashing, twice? I think the second crash was more of a hang and then I had to force close. I cannot remember too well.
I didn't exactly start paying attention to every possible input/influence until after the fourth or fifth crash. I usually just accept that some imperfection is to be expected
Oh
Undo construction can go.
Enhanced sorting feels like it's part of something. That's not a mod I'd see myself getting on its own. Probably DS.
Cartograph, will be extremely hard to live without.
CrashSiteBeacons can go now.
You have too many Refined Power structures.
Ah. Felt this one coming but didn't think I got there yet.
I think the last time it was something like Plutonium or Uranium facilities, but in any case, it's dropping a lot of entries in that log.
I have 24 nuclear heaters outputting to 120 turbines. If this is "too many", I either need to buy a better computer (laptop, ssds, 16 gb ram, 3070 8gb, and 11th gen intel IIRC) or there is something fundamentally expensive about RP.
BUT, I have too many wind turbines. I know this. Especially when they aren't needed anymore.
The UObject limit is nothing to do with your hardware specs. The modular nature of a lot of RP stuff makes it fundamentally UObject-heavy.
Maybe my mind is oversimplifying or there is something I don't know but wouldnt the game run better with less things in it? And wouldn't "bigger" computer be able to "handle more" before showing issues? Because, isn't it just an in-engine value to try to guide the performance optimization process? And isn't performance optimization based on the most common denominator? And if the most common denominator is, in ranking performance, less powerful than my own, wouldn't that mean that I, as a user, wouldn't notice an issue that was occurring until much later than the most common denominator?
My mind could be approaching it all wrong but that is my thought process.
Other wonderings include:
Are particles and sounds UObjects?
Are RP machines producing particles and sounds?
Can the particles and sounds be turned off?
All questions I shall find the answer to next time I open the game. I don't actively troubleshoot when I'm frustrated for mental health reasons, so I'll report back within 24 hours, after i chillax a bit.
I mentioned the numbers and the specs because of my aforementioned assumptions and because, the last time I saw this issue, the user didn't feel anything till 500 turbines and didn't start crashing/hanging till 800ish
There is one uobject limit which is the same for everyone
Yes. Chosen by someone, some developer, either at Epic or CSS, to guide performance optimization for the most common denominator for the specific use case of this particular game, no?
Yes, but it isn't changeable by config/mods
I know (more like think i heard somewhere at some point in time) BLAndrew had to have his increased so I will need you to expand on what you are trying to say
Or what you think I am saying
So we can rectify the miscommunication.
It sounds to me like you're saying a better computer would solve your issue, but it wouldn't because your save would make the same number of uobjects and the limit would still be the same, so you'd still hit it
I don't know who BLAndrew is and a quick search of this discord didn't help me there, either
One of the players that building "too big"
Ok, so you can increase your uobject limit but it isn't recommended https://satisfactory.wiki.gg/wiki/Unreal_Engine#:~:text=Unreal%20Engine%20UObject%20Limit,-The%20Unreal%20Engine&text=The%20default%20limit%20set%20in,%2C%20not%20in%2Dgame%20objects.
Official Satisfactory Wiki
Unreal Engine
Satisfactory is developed in Unreal Engine, which comprises a series of 3D computer graphics game engines developed by Epic Games.
Development started with version 4.16–4.18 in the Closed Alpha. The game stayed on Unreal Engine 4 up until Patch 0.8.0.0, when it was ported to Unreal Engine 5.
Whether different elements are uobjects varies from mod to mod based on implementations
Ah. I understand how you can come to this conclusion.
I believe, if I was on the fringe ends of the issue because of naturally occurring UObjects, that I would notice the issue less or later if my computer was better. This thought occurs by trying to understand the technologies in general. For my specific issue, I know that the UObject limit isn't being hit by normal gameplay, but by an issue/bug/mod. Therefore, I am suggesting that I, as a user, may have been more prone to ignoring the stuttering and other performance related issues because I have a slightly better computer than the most common denominator that game developers will optimize their game for. Also, having learned about (not mastered. Just know some things here and there) and used Unreal Engine, I have a sense of Epic Games' design principles and who their target developers are and what they expect them to be able to do. My typing box is getting small. I have to check that I hit everything necessary So, in theory, a supercomputer doesn't solve the issue but delays it. You can edit your UObject limit but if you didn't code your game/mod properly or there are conflicts or you didn't optimize or a host of other possible factors, it will still create too many or even unnecessary UObjects, and even if your limit was a quadrillion, you would inevitably hit it. BUT, if everything is working fine and the uobject are within "a decent range for the most common denominator", then there will be no negligible difference between running on a supercomputer versus....uhh....a nokia phone (I am hyperbolizing or exaggerating here cause I can't come up with an actual low spec computer that can run the game) </thought> Follow up questions, or we on the same page now?
I believe, if I was on the fringe ends of the issue because of naturally occurring UObjects, that I would notice the issue less or later if my computer was better. This thought occurs by trying to understand the technologies in general. For my specific issue, I know that the UObject limit isn't being hit by normal gameplay, but by an issue/bug/mod. Therefore, I am suggesting that I, as a user, may have been more prone to ignoring the stuttering and other performance related issues because I have a slightly better computer than the most common denominator that game developers will optimize their game for. Also, having learned about (not mastered. Just know some things here and there) and used Unreal Engine, I have a sense of Epic Games' design principles and who their target developers are and what they expect them to be able to do. My typing box is getting small. I have to check that I hit everything necessary So, in theory, a supercomputer doesn't solve the issue but delays it. You can edit your UObject limit but if you didn't code your game/mod properly or there are conflicts or you didn't optimize or a host of other possible factors, it will still create too many or even unnecessary UObjects, and even if your limit was a quadrillion, you would inevitably hit it. BUT, if everything is working fine and the uobject are within "a decent range for the most common denominator", then there will be no negligible difference between running on a supercomputer versus....uhh....a nokia phone (I am hyperbolizing or exaggerating here cause I can't come up with an actual low spec computer that can run the game) </thought> Follow up questions, or we on the same page now?
Yep!
Recommendations from Epic are related to their target audience.
For example, their tech works for Hollywood budget films. But it requires a computer(s) with vastly different set of specs and their advice/recommended practices/techniques is vastly different if that is your use case
(P.S. this is also related to why people think UE5 games are crappy. Cause the devs aren't doing the work and blaming the engine. But that's a can of worms I'm not too interested in eating from)
Interesting, but I'm not convinced any of this is getting you any closer to a solution 😅
Not at all but it is making me less angry about it, and a clear and calm mind is necessary when trying to solve any problem
McCovican gave me, like, 4 or 5 things to do. Until I try them, actually approaching a solution is impossible. Can't get anywhere if you don't walk (or roll or some other traversal accomodation technologies. Wheelchairs and such are a thing)
Just not in the books for me in the next 3 hours
Slightly unrelated, but more so a clear user error, a slightly better computer than I have now wouldn't max out my ram (I hover at about 15.7/16. No less than 15.2) because I have 70 tabs on chrome open while playing a computationally intensive factory simulation game, actually making the game run a bit better. Cause it does run better when Chrome is closed. And I know Chrome does have performance saving features built it but they don't work if you constantly alt tab and flip through (therefore loading) 20 sleeping tabs looking for that one thing from 3 days ago.
Working on your suggestions.
Just dropped my save into SCIM. Intuition tells me that 663 total buildings from Refined Power is an okay number. I do understand that 1 visible object =/= 1 UObject. I do also understand that RP is habitually UObject heavy. Some things I could do that wouldn't fundamentally break my factories/workflow/enjoyement would be deleting the wind and water turbines (not the water dams) and that would eliminate 150ish from that 663 (equals 510ish). And that's only 24 nuclear heaters/120 generators at full capacity. Something feels very wrong or i'm using it completely wrong if it can't make 60GW without unmanageable UObject bloat.
But I do have some doubts about the nearly 1800 Digital Storage buildings being fine. And I have not done whatever you did to let you come to the conclusions that you came to, so from a completely ignorant POV, I wonder if you were actually seeing RP and not DS. I don't doubt your expertise. I just can't figure out why the products of my problem solving procedures are bringing me to the EXACT same conclusion as you.
That being said, depending on how DS handles itself and how the portable miner collector works, I could definitely see that being the problem. I have, maybe, 750ish portable miners? And, at peak, the collector collects from them every 15ish seconds? That's a lot of distributed calculation, no?
Unless there is something that i am fundamentally not understanding. And I'm not sure what question to ask to figure out what I don't know I don't know so....
My next steps are to boot the game without (most of) the mods you mentioned were issues. I'll then fly around and replace all the turbines with power poles. I can't imagine doing it in SCIM would be easier but maybe it is and I just don't know. Then I'll go back to using the drop down menus in the crafting server and, if i'm still running into the problem, I'll report back.
If i'm no longer running into the problem, I'll report back with a conclusion.
From what you mentioned, Cartographer stayed and Enhanced Sorting is a dependency for something. I turned off any other mods that I don't need, along with the ones you mentioned were issues. Also, the Enhanced Sorting mod page states "The mod has no noticeable effect if the inventory being sorted has no filtered slots." so, if true, that would align with your assumption of "possibly, but unlikely".
Why didn't FRED read my log like he does for other people?