Let's figure this out... Pufferfish, Folia, MultiPaper, startup flags and more
Server hardware: (attached screenshot)
Aikar's flags without modification: https://pastebin.com/PnPV7id0
I modify Aikar's flags with the correct RAM allocation and for my start.sh script to create a new screen environment to run the server on:
https://pastebin.com/pyxsPFBe
Going to share some console logs in a minute.
Pastebin
java -Xms10G -Xmx10G -XX:+UseG1GC -XX:+ParallelRefProcEnabled -XX:M...
Pastebin.com is the number one paste tool since 2002. Pastebin is a website where you can store text online for a set period of time.
Pastebin
#!/bin/shscreen -d -m -S "mc" java -Xms62G -Xmx62G -XX:+UseG1GC -XX...
Pastebin.com is the number one paste tool since 2002. Pastebin is a website where you can store text online for a set period of time.
542 Replies
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Requested by ocintac#0
ooh nice specs.
What are you going to be running on your server, and how many players are you expecting?
Is the server released?
Haha, well, Aikar's flags are totally working now. On my test environment (a VPS machine) the flags didn't work but on my production environment with the mentioned specs it works fine. Makes sense I guess
Oh okay lol
HOLD UP
you're allocating...
62GB of RAM?
Yess
should I be leaving more for the OS?
you typically never allocate more than 12gb to a singular mc server
i gave the OS 2 gigs to spare
Well
2gb is fine, but 62gb ram to the mc server is way too much
I have all this ram setting around
sitting*
it's a dedi correct
yes
you don't allocate more than 12gb of RAM because of performance reasons
I remember reading about that some years ago
i'll summarise it:
java garbage collection issue
yes
ye
the more RAM, the longer GC takes, the longer the server pauses, more lag
so if there were hundreds of players 12G would be fine?
"What are you going to be running on your server, and how many players are you expecting?
Is the server released?"
Basically, the server isn't released but I make viral tiktoks in Poland
it's a Polish meme server, bober kurwa
How many players will you be expecting
I expect to get a lot of players but I could be wrong
my goal is 150 online
a numerical value would be nice
okay.
I'd like to realistically support 200
Honestly?
I'd recommend you try optimise with Pufferfish beforehand.
Folia requires a lot of work and isn't perfectly stable
you can't slap any plugins onto Folia
plus, folia regionises lag, doesn't solve it.
I already got the plugins working
my colleague already developed a custom landclaim plugin for folia
62gb memory allocated to the server ☠️
kek
yessir
Stick at 12gb for now.
okay but how am I going to take advantage of all dis ram
you don't lmao
i do remember that issue with garbage collection
or you run other servers for other things
ya i guess i'll run a webserver
(e.g. make a network or something, but that would prob be a future thing lmao)
!optimise <- honestly, check out Pufferfish, and optimise.
Or stick with folia as you have the hardware, but again it's not a perfect solution
You can follow these guides to optimize your server
Admincraft Canned Responses
Well. Minecraft won't be able to benefit from having that much extra.
So, what's your guys opinion for building a 150 player server
The perfect specs
and software
I think the specs are fine but there's some doubt about Folia
The specs are fine, a 7950X is one of the best CPUs for mc
Just reduce the allocated ram to 12GB and I'm good?
yeah
Oki
I have one huge problem with folia and it's killing me
I added beavers to Minecraft using mythic mobs and folia doesn't support mythic mobs. It's the one plugin I have yet to find a replacement for. My developer is gonna spend 2 months making an entity engine for Folia
So if there's any proof that another fork of Paper can actually support a couple hundred players it would save some time and money on this project
well a fair few use high player count servers use uspigot
Yes but they
are networks
no single server.
One world with 200 players without a worldborder?
pls send the IP
freshsmp does 600+
etc
pufferfish itself can do high playercounts just a lot of optimizations required
Everyone says PaperMC can't realistically handle much more than 80 players
okay, pufferfish
ive seen 100+ with paper and it working fine
but pufferfish should be used
^^
They may have developers making custom optimizations on those servers
yes but iirc they're based on pufferfish?
yes, donut's infrastructure is very unique
but Pufferfish is solid
as long as you optimize it
okay, i'll go with this. there's no way to know it will work until i release the server
uspigot is mostly whats behind the performance
i mean, i have no idea how many players will join
oh they use uspigot
freshsmp does*
ah
Spigot, dang they have some interesting infrastructure
Without compromises*
USpigot*
UniverseSpigot
ohh
that's new to me
it's a paid fork of Pufferfish / Paper, with extremely impressive performance
Great, really helpful
thank you
($70)
Is this the correct link to that fork? https://pufferfish.host/downloads
Pufferfish Host | Downloads - Pufferfish Fork
Download Pufferfish and Pufferfish+ Minecraft server jars
no
what, to Pufferfish or universe?
universe
didn't come to the top on my search results
no
Universe is no longer on any public sites (It uses to be on Polymart but they got falsely DMCA'd and you have to purchase via discord)
I can DM you the invite link if you wish
Great!
sounds cool
I'll need to ask them about it
i need to tell my developer to stop making the folia plugin until we test this o_O
There's some comfort in using Folia because of how it fundamentally changes chunkloading
iirc plugins that use things like FoliaLib to be compatible with Folia still are cross compatible with paper servers
I know
He's making a cool blockclaim plugin for me
nice :)
woah nice specs
lol
sharing is caring, drop the ssh key
haha
:OMEGALUL:
what provider out of interest
k.pl
yah, i know
it's not well known
never heard of em
everyone knows ram = performance duh
they're from the same city i live in
ah
i wanted a Polish provider
fair enough
that can come with downsides
yep
ping/worse routing etc than more established datacenters etc
their price is competitive and i can literally walk to their datacenter and look at my machine
u5Ytf2.png
I just wasted 115144 bytes on this image
why are gameservers more expensive than dedis
antiddos i guess
dude
i mean to be fair folia wouldn't be a bad choice no?
depends on what kind of plugins you're adding, since those would need to be converted to folia. if you are gonna add a lot of plugins, i'd recommend pufferfish if this is just a meme server.
otherwise folia is probably the better option considering your hardware?
wtf
7950x3d for 100 gbp/month
cheeeap
give me the money for it, thanks
uh usually not doable due to security reasons atleast u1's dont just randomly get to show up
afaik
go ask shaum for a 99% discount on a dedi
depends on the datacenter but /shrug/
folia would run AWESOME but not only is it not production ready it also lacks a healthy amount of plugins
so you're on your own
XD
isn't 2B2T using folia?
well its not even u1 cause its rented
so i doubt you get access to the building at all
2b2t is little to no modified
and the modifications are custom
The thing is I already got 90% of the plugins I need working. I meant to say the marketing strategy is a meme marketing strategy but the server itself is not a meme
well, folia can be used in production well.
and it would be the best way to take advantage of their hardware, i speak as a person who owns a ryzen 7950x for their own server lol.
and in this case, its just a meme server, and they only are going to use a few/their own custom made plugins. might as well use folia then
folia will be a headache while switching
then i probably say stick with folia
if players arent spread out enough folia would perform worse than pufferfish
The Polish mc playerbase is loco
^^ what pro said
i agree. which is why we also use pufferfish on the servers which arent
Wait sorry to take this away from the OP. i have 15gb on my server so is its worse than 12gb i thought because the post i saw about that was so old i disregarded it.
this is a smp though iirc?
you're fine
Folia regionises lag, doesn't solve it.
and since Folia doesn't use Pufferfish patches, lag is probably worse
yes
15-16 is fine
interesting
if you don't use the all RAM (/spark healthreport) it's unnecessary performance drawback
im gonna keep using 62gb LOL
jk
then yea, with ur own plugins u should be fine.
pufferfish will definitely, 100% be better for smaller regions
find out how much RAM you use regularly and add maybe 1-2GB onto it
you should be fine with that
^^
smart ❤️
So purpur would do the same thing right? because its a fork
yes, at the moment
I've heard purpur doesn't have all of pufferfish's patches anymore
^
iirc they don't pull upstream from pufferfish anymore
it's still a good option if you want the customizability without the need of a seperate plugin
I think Folia is going to be necessary. 10,000 block radius RTP
i'm hoping you'd pregen
it's already done with pregen
you'll be fine, though if you already have a bukkit (paper, pufferfish etc.) server switching will be an headache
mostly because a lot of stuff will have to be ported to work with folia
depends
mostly
yes
a lot
just curious whats the gb of the world size?
:KEKW:
one sec
they said they already had 90% of their plugins to work with folia
the majority of plugins use libraries that make folia & paper servers cross compatible
is this for the paper API or bukkit API though
folia
what's the linux command for finding file size?
They do they just wait like 2 dayish
df -h
should do
no
i dont trust u
ls -lh ig?
oh
yeah
xd
that shows the total disk usage
my bad
hehe ok
ls -lh <file name>
makes sense
you can install this lovely apt package called ncdu
apt install ncdu, and then ncdu /
it works well and is basically windirstat for linuxPterodactyl. Pain in the ass to setup but greatest open source panel.
that's what I got
164k
yeah well that won't work
164k what
btw it's only 10k X 10k blocks preloaded
du -sh folder_path try that?.
can you try
this and navigate to your server
oki
worked
14G
oh not bad
did you pregen nether / end?
nope
good idea
ooh yeah thats a folder
14gb of pregen
might want to do that xD
uh how much did you pregen
10k
I remember one of my old servers it was 30k x 30k it was 89
Oh wait
nvk
10k rtp, with 10k pregen?
10k is small for a big server ngl
and you have a 1tb disk
^
well, world sizes depends on how much you want ppl to interact with one another
pregen 10k radius on nether now
https://onlinemo.de/world nice resource
World Size Calculator
Determine the file size of a world before you pregenerate
hold on
I doubt if pregenning will improve that much since rtp is set to such high radius: https://discord.com/channels/348681414260293634/1247565563853668353/1247573968781578331
remember 1 block in the nether is 8 blocks in the ovw
so 10k overworld is 1250 blocks in the nether
Your setup should be able to run Folia.
I'll pregen more
no shit
jenkins confirmed, must be legit
is spawn going to be in the normal world or are you making a void world?
my potato can run folia
doesnt mean its good, worth it, or makes sense
i ran folia on an OCI instance lmao
for fun
50k radius pregen?
I mean
100k?
It's a 16 core cpu
careful not to consume all your disk :kek: -> https://onlinemo.de/world
World Size Calculator
Determine the file size of a world before you pregenerate
50k i'd say
its within the recommended spec iirc
Tried and then quit because i was to dumb to get it to work.
yeah the recommended spec is 16 cores 32 threads
^
but "Run" is running
Can recommend these
this Polish company took 5 days to setup the high-end gameserver. might've been the first one to order it and they had to buy parts, lol
not run well
eh i know people who run folia well on this hardware
Holy maybe 20k - 10k - 15k
?!
i dont think the performance will be a issue
well the first test was done on a r9 7950x3d
20k for overworld 10k for nether 15k for end
again depends
wasnt talking about his hardware
end wont take up as much im pretty sure
for a 200 player server?
Start slow ig
then wym?
just pregen 35m
I'm gonna make the player limit 1000 and just see what happens
i know the polish kids will like my memes
35 million?
💀
hahaha
yes
i like your words magic man
they're expecting 150-200+
what's the point of pregenning too little and realising it's not enough, and having to close the server to pregen more
very funny man
that sounds like a great use of a tb of data
actually, more probably
might need more than tbs
lmao
wait, the hard drive the server is running on is only 500GB
if there is 1tb i would use 350gb on world stuff and then 500gb on player data and backups.
there's a 2nd 500G hard drive
a lot more
am I gonna need to upgrade that?
Please dont forget about backup space
Maybe 2 1TB drive running RAID
you'd wanna run the server on HDD's as it'd be too costly to run on SSD or NVMe's with 35m pregen
^
Nah
I recommend eMMC storage
ssds have gotten cheap
er
much more reliable
also how are you gonna fit that many SSD's into the server :KEKW:
I remember buying SSDs when they were first released and it was $1/GB
250 SSD for $250
ew
if i remember correctly
2.5$, take it or leave it
yea i have one ssd (250gb) and one hdd (750) according to my host
1tb xd
@OcintacWait what's with that link in your bio?
Thats good price i bought mine in my pc for like 180
LOL
it's from 1 year ago
ignore it
but thats the begining
try
lsblk to find outI was teaching English in Poland
now some asian company took the website
Learn English while playing Minecraft!
i should fix my bio
lol
But I had a neat little english teaching business using minecraft as a classroom environment
There probably right 250gb for boot and 750 for everything else
interactive activities
did you just say 250gb used for boot
he clearly needs the bootloader
Bootloaders are very bloated these days
they are NOT bloated 250GB
GRUB takes like, 2tb smh
ah yes
the .iso file is 10TB
Okay so conclusion
Using Folia
No, duh
12GB to start and add more as needed
They're using advanced compression technology
preload all worlds
To compress it down to 3gb
generate
but yes
I really would not recommend that...
You have 64gb ram
that's actually not a bad idea
why not use more
jenkins fuck off
someone explain to jenkins
go back to your dirt shack
what the fuck
you all told me
he's trolling
a bit too far
^
ok ok
I mean, you could mount Google Drive onto the server and use that as swap
That'd be more reliable
xD
I almost did allocate 128 GB of ram
you don't even have 128gb xd
yeah but for a tiny bit more they were offering 128 gb
i just thought I'd upgrade to it if i need it
ew
you'll never need that with a single server
;-;
perfect time for you to start a minecraft hosting
:KEKW:
i wonder if i can tell my hosting provider to remove 32 gigs of ram and give me a discount
Swap is this amazin' tecknology that magically turns storage into RAM! Yes, usable RAM!
they'd charge you extra for the technician to remove it
Idk ill send you a screenshot of the specs
Also @Ocintac if you use ZGenerational you probably won't suffer with 20GB
I'm not joking
maybe 250GB is somehow reserved for bootloader
oh its 1tb
Could go as high as 30gb
ew
Not that you need it...
i no longer trust u mr jenkins
2950X and 128GB ram
Just that you "can"
get a better cpu and less ram
also that hdd 🤢
bought like 2 years ago
no i'm serious
off of hetzner
i almost used hetzner, similar prices but worst ping in poland
ok i believe u jenkins
i would like to utilize my ram
I got mine in phoenix lucky me
do you trust me though :sad:
idk man u seem sus
but mb
my profile's a joke
call me "eternal" lol
okaaay
not a joke!
he works at mzungu
Mzungu is a gold Microsoft partner...
Did you know Azure resells Mzungu?
Now you know!
So, do you guys want to hear my monetization plan?
You can roast me
better not be p2w
it's pay for quality of life
Should i pull the trigger on this 50 bucks more thou
@Ocintac, as you also said:
1. decrease RAM usage (12-16GB would be a good starting point)
2. use folia or pufferfish/purpur
3. pregenerate your world
i get like 80 players
it's not a competitive PVP server either
that's basically it
@Ocintacif you ever need more ram keep ZGenerational in mind
❤️
oki
can someone pin mustafa's post
If im correct mc made mini update just to update to java 21
basically has my answer in it
hmm, can't pin the specific reply
it's ok just gonna past it down
you do not have perms
yeah a staff member can
then no
not a good one
i make like 140 a month
what are you going to run?
i would lose 20
right its not a good machine
in the first place
there's too many drives on that thingy
a mining server with 29 worlds currently
for minecraft
an unnecessary amount of drives
I doubt if you'd need more than 256GB for a server that isn't open world
uh, someone was gonna direct me to the Universal Spigot people
i sent you a DM
still want to look at that
ok
universespigot?
no galaxyspigot
i mean each world takes up 3gb
yes universespigot
a very good optimized fork of spigot, the owner's also here
yes
if you read the thread
if you give the owner a kiss on the cheek he'll give you a 5$ discount
I recommend Universal
you would have seen we already talked about it
wait the creator of universal is here?
@MachineBreaker
indeed
@MachineBreaker
hi machine
@MachineBreaker
okay hi mr machine
xD
@MachineBreaker
wakey wakey
new customer
stop pinging machine
WAIT DID MACHINE BECOME A FEMBOY
no no
what is Universal
i am not customer
i use folia
fake
universespigot
XD
it is a high performance fork of Pufferfish (paid)
I cant find the page
there is no public page
I JUST WANTED TO LEARN MORE
it was taken down from polymart
Oh
false DMCA'd
bla bla
^ they got falsely DMCA'd and after the first they didn't want to take another one
sad
you can buy through their discord server
so now they only accept purchases from their server
yeah
how much better performance exactly
a lot
you could easily get 400-500 on
"easily"
Mhm..
with optimisation
lmao
@AeonRemnant any numbers you can give based off the benchmarks we did using that servcity's epyc?
Okay so that literally makes it not easy
you're making me question my life choices
that was US+
like from purpur to universespigot maybe a 30% boost
who cares
probably more
Damn, the americans made a plus version?
fuck off
america+
more guns, more democracy
50%!!!!
possibly
we've only properly benchmarked US+
which iirc we got in the regions of 1k bots
What the hell is US+
a paid DLC
universespigot+
universespigot+
Ah
Glorified America
It's like America
But more guns
I thought it was a paid dlc to america
jenkins go back to your dirt shack
And the police is harder to evade
a W.I.P (afaik) version of universespigot with more performance and patches
normal UniverseSpigot is 70$
then US+ requires you to own normal US and then $60/month
yeah WIP
shit pricing
Is it pretty much agreed that Folia is a good option?
eh
it's pretty experimental
Depends on who you ask
and not production-ready
debateable
oh thats bit a expensive sounds like adobe pricing
but it should run fine
if stuff break you'll be mostly on your own
it's only for very big servers.
if it was monthly
just get axolotlspigot smh
budget friendly
no
DMCA-included
:KEKW:
has anyone server ever randomly hit 21 tps and then quickly go back to 20
how are you measuring that
what
yes
tps catchup
idk it just happens randomly
never heard of that one
oh
purpur
but you shouldn't see any noticeable difference right
PurpurMC Documentation - Configuration
The official documentation for Purpur. Purpur is a fork of Pufferfish (and by extension, Paper) with the goal of providing new and interesting configuration options, which allow for creating a unique gameplay experience not seen anywhere else.
some measurements to avoid the server from going brrt
its also a paper thing
its just
oh interesting
a option to disable in purpur
is it bad to disable or good
eh
doesn't matter
TPS catchup makes your server tick faster than 20 TPS after any period of time that is below 20. This is an attempt at keeping the average TPS as close to 20 as possible, but does come with its own set of side effects, an example being when players get insta-killed by mobs during a lag spikeit's a double-edged sword
Doesnt really matter for me i have keep inv on
that's just a example
you guys are making the largest questions thread rn
nop
Nah
you haven't seen the anticheat threads
those are over 4k messages
^ kek
i'm using nocheatplus
has folia support on its fork
no
😭
before I was using vulcan
i would definitely not use nocheatplus
use Updated NoCheatPlus
not NCP
find me a better one that supports folia
GitHub
GitHub - Updated-NoCheatPlus/NoCheatPlus: Anti-cheating plugin for ...
Anti-cheating plugin for Minecraft (1.5-1.20, Bukkit/Spigot) - Updated-NoCheatPlus/NoCheatPlus
i'll gladly switch
grim does have folia support
grim
GRIM
i love you guys
what the fuck is grim
welcome to admincraft, though I must say you've seen something :KEKW:
GitHub
GitHub - GrimAnticheat/Grim: Fully async, multithreaded, predictive...
Fully async, multithreaded, predictive, open source, 3.01 reach, 1.005 timer, 0.01% speed, 99.99% antikb, "bypassable" 1.8-1.20 anticheat. - GrimAnticheat/Grim
i'm gonna compile that shit and boot it up
i dont understand why its mentions "bypassable"
send u the error log
It used to say unbypassable
But he changed that after Grim got a lot of attention and well, got bypassed in the process
He got exhausted, left Grim
There is a build available on Hangar
it's fine i already compiled it from github
I have very sad news for you
waaat
GitHub
Update SECURITY.md · GrimAnticheat/Grim@d108355
Fully async, multithreaded, predictive, open source, 3.01 reach, 1.005 timer, 0.01% speed, 99.99% antikb, "bypassable" 1.8-1.20 anticheat. - Update SECURITY.md · GrimAnticheat/Grim@d108355
You can just... download it
eh
For safety reasons we do not allow executables to be sent as they might contain malware. If you're compiling for someone please DM them and as a reminder. We cannot verify if a compiled jar has not been tampered in any way
oh well
what did you try send
the artifact
oh
I kind of like having all the builds on my github desktop
😭
just refresh it and build it whenever i see updates
fair
You can literally do that on github
yes
;-;
idk
should I boost the server and join mustafa
no
boosting has zero benefits
you're better off boosting those egirl hangout servers
dm me the link
idk
what
too popular meh
i want the admincraft clout
(i literally just typed .gg/egirl lmao)
get level 30+ and beat pgdk
that's even better
oop
Ok boosted
nice :)
I should boost my own discord lol
🤡
🪞^^
Universe is built off our open source code but go hard king
right not what i said, uspigot the software they use is still a major part of the performance
the jar you use matters a lot
Those tests were not scientific nor repeatable since they were using beta software.
But as Diz has authorised me testing and I’ve since got permission from Kevin and Machine, I have access to Axolotl, US, US+, PF, and PF+.
My only condition on testing is Kevin requested tick skipping disabled. The compromise is I agreed to test with and without tick skipping enabled.
So we’ll get a good idea of where the best general performance sits.
when are you going to start the testing?
also what hardware? the server provided by servcity again?
& are you just going to use bots or some sort of production server?
Is Vulcan 2.8.6 safe im scared to switch back ever since the incident
yes its safe, dont ask here
Saw you guys were talking about anticheat sorry
Why i got like 4 pings here
I’ll be testing on hardware either provided or purchased, running within 5% of rated base and boost speed.
So that means no RS.
I’ll likely run some ARM tests, and some tests on 7950X, 7950X3D, and 5950X.
Talk with cosmos as well if you want help or other data points he's doing some tests I believe with Ricky.
I need to be running this clinically, so I’ll be coordinating with a few people to establish a more pure testing methodology first.
If you need anything from us lmk
Once that’s finished I’ll begin some preliminary testing to see if my work is broken. Once that is finished I’ll begin datapoint harvesting for real.
Then data analysis needs to be done to determine which fork is actually the best.
Yes they plan to add pufferfish patxhes back when pufferfish comes out on 1.20.6
Universe spigot was recommended to the op
your server will have stutters because of this. Java isn't designed to garbage collect this much memory without stuttering when using G1GC. You'd need to either use less ram (12gb), or use a different GC, like shenandoah. With that being said, unless your render distance is set too high or a plugin has a memory leak, a single minecraft server can't use that much memory
It was a joke
But interesting
I didn’t know about the alternative flags
it's still better to have less memory allocated as possible. Shenandoah uses more cpu than G1GC
but has less gc pauses
I’m using 12G for now, maybe I’ll need to find a way to increase it in the future
ZGC :)
:OMEGALUL:
Prove the concept before spending money. Sorry for trying to suggest that. 😅
There is such thing as over allocating memory
Yeah
Because of how Java garbage collection works
yes
👍
please don't actually allocate your entire box to the process
Haha I know
pog
Wish me luck
for sure
It was just weird you didn’t want to talk on the discussion board
I'm in the process of making a comparison video of some tests I did for pufferfish vs universe vs diz's jar
will lyk when I post that
Like I said sorry for trying to help
oh back on the original topic
I wouldn't consider folia yet, paper is likely going to make considerable API changes still for folia so I'd wait till they have a stable API
Unless you are developing 100% yourself and are fine with major API changes
Yeah I have a full time developer as my partner. My only problem with folia is getting our version of MEG3 to work
I know developers on folia who got meg working with it
Iirc meg also has native folia support now
Oh that'd be meg4 tho
If you value bedrock support then stick with meg3
Hmm when I was testing lirc on the latest folia build it wasn’t working, but it seems like there’s gonna be a way
I’m not worried about bedrock because Polish people mainly play on Java
fair
might as well just go to meg 4 then
I’m pretty sure most of the negative affects regarding allocating a lot of memory do go away with certain GCs.
But to be honest there isn’t too much of a benefit either
And in general those gcs come with other compromises
Like higher cpu usage etc
It’s not that significant
Esp with their cpu
The benefits are bigger than the downsides
And the CPU hit isn't even that big
depends on the GC, and it depends on the server
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I know personal experience isn't really valid proof but I've been using GenZGC for a very long time
And I have zero issues
The CPU difference isn't even close to being noticable
You don't run anything sensitive enough to make it noticable.
But losing 30 players in overhead is noticable.
???????
There's almost no difference dude
and big servers run it too
When you're using a fork where hyper optimized GC is required your server is very likely running 800+ players, think Folia.
Wrong circumstances you lose players.